Monday, July 13, 2009

Intermarriage: Great Mourning Among The Jews

21 of the Fourth Month 5769

No, the title is not a reference to the recently invented concept of mourning practices during the "Three Weeks" between the Fast of the Fourth Month (17 b'Tammuz) and the Fast of the Fifth Month (9 b'Av).
Clinton’s Top Muslim Aide to Wed Jewish Congressman
Tzvi Ben Gedalyahu, 21 Tammuz 5769/July 13, 2009

( Brooklyn, New York Democratic Congressman Anthony Weiner will marry outside the Jewish religion to Huma Abedin, a Muslim woman who is considered one of U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton’s top aides, the New York Daily News reported.

The intermarriage rate in the United States is estimated to be approximately 50 percent and has been one of the strongest forces that has diluted Jewish identity and support of a strong Israel.

This report immediately brought to mind a verse from Megillath Esther. During the chanting of the this megillah on Purim, many Ashkinazim have the custom of chanting the last part of this verse using the mournful ta'amei hamiqra* (music) used to chant Eikhah (Lamentations) on the Fast of the Fifth Month, to emphasize the gravity of what is taking place at this point in the story.
אסתר ד,ג
אֵבֶל גָּדוֹל לַיְּהוּדִים, וְצוֹם וּבְכִי וּמִסְפֵּד; שַׂק וָאֵפֶר, יֻצַּע לָרַבִּים...

Esther 4:3
...there was great mourning among the Jews, and fasting, and weeping, and wailing; and many lay in sackcloth and ashes.
It is truly a day of mourning, when one of our own goes off to "marry" a non-Jew. How many more Jewish babies will NOT be born, due to intermarriage?

I have come under fire for daring to call intermarriage the "Second Holocaust."

But, that's essentially what it is.

The above article continues with a list of Rep. Weiner's "pro-Israel" stances and actions.

1. Rep. Weiner introduced the "Saudi Arabia Accountability Act" in Congress (2007). (Big deal. Has it helped curb secret Saudi funding to terrorist organizations?)

2. He tried to ban the PA delegation from entering the United Nations (2006). (Big deal. He should have led the charge in the U. S. to leave the U. N.)

3. Rep. Weiner is considered a “defender of Israel” and is a supporter of the Zionist Organization of America (ZOA), but has not recently taken a strong stand in favor of a Jewish presence in Judea and Samaria. (Surprised?)

4. He did say that U.S. President Barack Obama went “too far" in opposing building for Jewish “natural growth” in Judea and Samaria. (eyes rolling - I really feel bad for this guy. He REALLY thinks he's trying to help us. But does he consider "us" to be even remotely related to him?)

5. However, Rep. Weiner also justified the president’s position. "President Obama said that part of his mission was to speak the truth to friends," he said. "Well I think that I'm doing that with President Obama--being truthful in saying that he got it wrong when he went as far as he did on settlements. That doesn't mean that I don't support him and that he's not a friend to Israel.” (Are you as confused by this doublespeak as I am? More consequences of assimilated "American Jewish education.")

6. He also said that he thinks President Obama’s stand against a Jewish presence in Judea and Samaria is designed to help PA Chairman Mahmoud Abbas. (Translation: Let's care about keeping a terrorist in power, so that worse terrorists don't get control,...even though that's what these people want.)

If this is "pro-Israel," then I would hate to go back and look at the statements of those members of congress who are considered anti-Israel.

I believe that he believes that he is "pro-Israel," and that he is trying to do the right thing,...even though he obvious is not. Israel is the homeland
promised to Am Yisrael, and to no other. Being "pro-Israel" means believing that this cannot be compromised.

Do I blame Rep. Weiner for his marriage to a non-Jew and his distorted views on Israel? No. How can I, considering the spiritual state of the Jewish People residing in the U. S.?
"Once there was a television program which centered on the theme of intermarriage. The heroes of the piece were named Bernie and Bridget. The American Jewish Establishment put great pressure on the network that televised the series and the program was ultimately dropped. Bernie and Bridget were no longer. They had been canceled…

"How relatively simple it was to cancel Bernie and Bridget on television and how much more difficult to struggle against the intermarriage and assimilation that exist in real American Jewish life...

"...Now, Bernie, you know the tragedy, the bankruptcy of the false “Judaism” you were fed. You know it without having to open this book and read these pages. You lived it, and, I say with a sad heart, you have been twisted and crippled by it. You were robbed by all the good people who gave you everything in life except the most important things – truth, meaning, identity.

"But never think that what you have seen is the real Judaism. Far from it. The Judaism that you never saw, and never were given to properly understand exists and awaits you. Stop for a moment and consider it. Forget about trying to escape from your people, your heritage, and your destiny. Forget all the nonsense that poses as “Judaism” – the mausoleums that pass for temples; the rabbis who preach salvation for all causes except the Jewish one; the people who created G-d in their own image, making Him emerge in the form of a UJA Israel Bond, Bar Mitzvah caterer and bagels and lox. Let me help you understand who you are, who your people are, what the times we live in mean for you for them, what the future holds for you, your people, and Israel. Forget the tragedy and consider the glory.
I wish that I could quote this entire chapter here.

In another book, by the same author, the scenario is presented of Jewish parents who tell their children they must marry Jews. The children ask why. But, all their parents can do is repeat their insistence that their children should marry Jews.

They do not know how to answer their children's question. This is the tragedy.

The above chapter is entitled "Intermarriage, Assimilation, And Alienation,"** and comes from the book Why Be Jewish? (1977) by Rabbi Meir Kahane hy"d. The scenario which follows in from the first chapter of the book Listen World, Listen Jew (1980).

I mention the author only now, as for some reason, the mention of Rabbi Kahane's name tends to scare people off, people who have never read any of his work, that is.

Even though I feel like I am talking to a brick wall here, I will conclude by reminding you of the last couple of weekly Torah portions

Is Rep. Weiner familiar with these Torah portions? And, if so, how many thousands of other Jews are not?

When these portions are taught, just how much distortion is needed to ease the assimilated Jewish mind into thinking that everything he does is alright, including marrying non-Jewish women, living in a foreign land, and collaborating in the grave Torah prohibition of mesirah (handing over) of Jewish lands to its enemies?

Probably not much distorted "interpretation" is necessary.

This is the tragedy.

Rep. Weiner,...Anthony,'s still not too late.


*I would like to encourage people to remove the bastardized word "trope" from your vocabulary, and replace it with the correct term "ta'amei hamiqra."

**Special thanks to Barabara Ginsburg for making excerpts of Rabbi Kahane's writings available online.


Daniel said...

While I totally agree that intermarriage in general is a tragedy for the Jewish people, Weinie's marriage is not.

Apparently his mother is a goy. His father married out and she had a conservative marriage conversion- hence he is a goy. As a representative of one of the largest Jewish comunities he has played up his "Jewish" credentials quite a bit and now maybe his upcoming marriage will expose him as the "liberal from hell" he truly is.
Also is it such a tragedy when liberal kapos from hell marry out? Is it so bad when kapo dreck like Weiners father, Adam Shapiro, and Stephen breyer or all those assholes that write to the NYT-"even though I am Jewish and a strong supporter of Israel, I am disgusted by their latest actions...." . It is no great loss. Let the children and grandchildren of survivors keep on popping out 10 kids, they'll make up for those who intermarry.

Esser Agaroth said...

ooooh. Thought I did my homework, but apparently, not enough.

It's actually an interesting question, and you might be surprised that, even if the beth din was pasul, as it certainly sounds like, and even if his mother had no intention of keeping misswoth, he may be a "safeq."

I have heard of cases like this before.

The children seeking to be frum were allowed to do an accellerated gi'ur lehumrah, as they sought out frumkeit, met the challenge of being told their not Jewish, and sought the difficult life anyway, among other reasons.

Please view this post as a reaction to intermarriage in general.

But, thank you for the correction.

Jack Steiner said...

. His father married out and she had a conservative marriage conversion- hence he is a goy.

That only applies to a relatively small group of people. The majority of Jews are Conservative or Reform and recognize those conversions as being valid.

It is provincial, narrow minded and foolish to try and thin the ranks because you don't like Conservative or Reform Judaism.

Let the children and grandchildren of survivors keep on popping out 10 kids, they'll make up for those who intermarry.

No they won't, the numbers don't work. Better to shift gears and try to come up with a plan that brings more people in.

Esser Agaroth said...

Sorry, Jack, but it's not about what I "like" or "don't like."

It's about what the halacha is.

Nonetheless, I would agree that as he perceived as Jewish {whether he is, or isn't, or is a safeq aside}, it is certainly something to pay attention to.

Please take the time to read the chapter I quoted {ie. "Forget all the nonsense that poses as “Judaism”"}. If you can, click the link, and read it in it's entirety. If you can, get Rabbi Kahane's book Listen World, Listen Jew. It's all about assimilation, and how it hasn't worked for us ever, so we should try a Jewish strategy instead.

Or get "Why Be Jewish?"

What can it hurt? I've read parts of Kaplan's "Judaism As A Civilization," among several other apikoursi books. I'm not proud of it. But, doesn't that make me open minded?

So, be a little open minded.

Reform "Judaism" was all about helping Jews to feel comfortable in Germany, Conservative "Judaism" was about making Jews feel comfortable in the U. S.

Jews do not belong in either country, and must always look to the ideal situation of living in the Jewish Homeland.

The truth is, that the Reform Movement's real motivations originally were to chip away at the Torah. They already accepted they couldn't do it all at once, so they went after the Oral Torah first.

...Just like the Saduccees.

The truth is that they believe in anything, and were no better than the intellectual secular snobs, the "maskilim" {Ben Gurion, Peres, Rabin, and now Beilin}.

The fact that it's been "evolving," and talking about spirituality and Talmud is only due to self serving interests.

Daniel said...

It is provincial, narrow minded and foolish to try and thin the ranks because you don't like Conservative or Reform Judaism.

Wrong. His father is/was Jewish by all standards. Weinie and his mother are not.

Of course if your standards were as high as ours people like wienies father wouldn't have spat on the graves of his ancestors who committed Kiddush Hashem than marryin
g out.

Esser Agaroth said...

Daniel, I'm not opposed to "creative" language. But, I just don't think the nickname "Wienie" is necessary.

I also go a step farther than you regarding the standards you mention.

It's not about being higher or lower; it's about be according to halacha.

IOW, dare I say it,...right or wrong.

Daniel said...

No they won't, the numbers don't work.

Actually , the numbers do work, hence the hatred of the hareidm .

Wienie is a descedant of those who left eastern europe against the advice of their rabbeim. It is no wonder that those who came from 1890-1910 have so many gentile projeny and were not only deafeningly silent during the Holocaust ,but had the audacity to condemn the Bergsonites.
It is the survivors and refugees of Hitler/Stalin that are the future of American Jewry. The rest are too busy loving Obama and having gentile or no children or in Wienies case muslim.

Daniel said...

OK, Wiener

Jack Steiner said...


We can go around and around in circles about what is halacha and what is minhag. We disagree about this and that is fine with me. I am not defined by others.

I do appreciate your reading the "outside" materials. I think that is good.

But we still disagree about a lot of this. Some things have to evolve whether people like it or not.

Of course if your standards were as high as ours

Blah, blah, blah. That is narishkeit. Let's ask Rubashkin about high standards. That is just silliness, but if it makes you feel good, ok.

Actually , the numbers do work, hence the hatred of the hareidm .

No, the numbers do not work unless you manipulate. If you want to play Bernie Madoff games you can.

The reality is that there are more Reform and Conservative Jews than Orthodox and always will be.

It doesn't matter whether you accept or acknowledge us either. BY gets it.

As for hatred or Haredim, if you want to play the victim, well that is your choice.

Esser Agaroth said...


We've agreed to disagree before, and I don't doubt we will again in the future.

I'm surprised you said between "halacha and minhag."

1. This is my very criticism of many in the "religious" world, and their ba'al tshuvah yeshivas.

2. I figured you just would've said outright "halacha."

More "Reform" and "Conservative" Jews?

That's the whole point. Many of them aren't really Jewish, due not only to invalid conversions, but also due to the belief by many in amongst the so called Reform that there is no need. Thus, many of the children born over the past how many decades are now Jewish.

{This is why there are discussions of what the halachic implications are when the majority of Jews live in, rather than outside Eretz Yisrael.}

Let me know how you like [or despise] Rabbi Kahane's books.

Daniel said...

No, the numbers do not work unless you manipulate. If you want to play Bernie Madoff games you can.

The average secular Jew- I am including unaffiliated , reform, conservative, gay, recontructionist and J4j- have up to a 70% intermarriage rate and a birth rate of 1.7( many of which are not even Jewish).
Hareidim have a doubling time of 7-10 years.

Why is the intermarriage rate only4% for frummies and up to 70% for the un-Orthodox? Many of the latter claim equivalence with Torah Jewry, so why do so many of you intermarry? What is so uncompelling about your isms that lead so many to marry out?

The reality is that there are more Reform and Conservative Jews than Orthodox and always will be.

If you count the number of secular Jews and their shiksa spouses who show up to temple twice a year theeform, conservative, gay, recontructionist and J4j win.
If you count the number who show up the following week for Sukkot we win.
If you count the number of children that go to temple up to 13-you win
If you count the number that go after 13 we win.
If you count who has only Jewish grandchildren we win.
If you count who keeps kosher we win.
who visits Isreal, goes to the Israeli day parade, day schools, become olim, etc......
Yes the first night of Rosh Hashana and Kol Nidre you win - but not for many more years.

By the way since "conservative Jewry" claims to keep halacha, what percent actually follow it ? I have seen statistics as low as 5%

Daniel said...

20 years ago I gave a very liberal friend a copy of "Why be Jewish". I told her to pretend it was by a different author. She loved it and felt that if it had been ghost written , it would have been a big seller

Ben-Shmuel said...

I'm disappointed in myself. I pride myself on having an incredible "gaydar" and I always thought Weiner was a faigelah. Some notable fruits of note that I outed over the years prior to their coming out are former NJ Gov. McGreevy, the guy from the Backstreet Boys, Elton John, and this guy who sat next to me during ulpan. I'm still going with my gut instinct. Besides being a self-loathing liberal, Weiner screams out "I am a homosexual". After all, even Elton John got married once.

Esser Agaroth said...

DBS, Don't know what to tell you. Go back to college for a special gaydar course?

Easy on the "fruit" and "nuts" analogies.

I'm from California, remember?

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